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Major Sigil Commentary  (Read 11850 times)

Offline VagrantSun

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #21 April 15, 2015, 04:01:31 AM
I'm starting to run out of Sigils! :o

So here's a bunch of basic ones, per your suggestion I do some of them too.
__________________________________________________________________________

Twisted Devil Sigil
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Replace the Clairvoyant Spirit with an Elder Ent; enemy teams don't have Power Balance, so they don't benefit from the Spirit's buff. Then slap a Spider Occultist in place of the Death Crafter, and you have yourself a Luck team.


~*~

Iron Golem Sigil
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Slide in an Ancient Ent and a pair of Dragon Revenants, who'll cover defense and debuffing respectively. Keep the Brownie Captain in the back buffing the Golem, and the last two slots should go to an Impaler Banshee and a Pit Wraith Redeemer, who'll help to buy time.


~*~

Dryad Keeper Sigil
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This one can be fun . . . a Pegasus, Siren Coercer and Phase Paladin for Shell shenanigans, then a Mutant Spinewhipper and Pit Wraith Liberator. To hell with attacking, let's be frustrating.


~*~

Harpy Hag Sigil
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First off, a Dark Brim Smith and Priest Vizier in the front row. A Sapphire Paragon and Occultist Spellbinder in the back, and top it off with a Wall Giant in the back - a pure Defense build.


~*~

Dragon Soldier Sigil
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A pair of Wildfire Efreets bookend the Health max debuff nicely. Load a Celestial Idol and a Fallen Carnage in the back to take advantage, with a Granite Golem between them to protect.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2015, 05:48:38 AM by VagrantSun »

Offline jamosup

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #20 April 14, 2015, 11:17:13 PM
S'all cool. True story: I play each Major Sigil before I make suggestions for it, along with a half-dozen others I don't choose to comment on. I do it all with the same team, a Fallen Carnage build that doesn't use spells, percentage damage, or debuffs, and I throw away two creature slots and an enchant on Nexus Amaranth, Nightwing Gargoyle, and Whoracle (buffs Emblem drops, resource drops, and legendary enchant drops).

I'm farming Major Sigils with effectively four monsters, and it's rare the enemy team ever gets a turn anyways.

I don't think that should happen, therefore the commentary.
Yeah, that does seem a bit too easy. I mostly just didn't want every single major sigil to warrant hours of grinding to deal with, though it should still require good strategy and changing up your team a bit now and then. :P It sounds like you've sort of sorted abilities out in tiers, though, with more basic/generic abilities just getting themed or "cool" teams, while very strong ones getting devious synergies that will require some thought to beat, so there'll still be some major sigils that aren't too complex to serve as an entry for new players.

Offline VagrantSun

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #19 April 14, 2015, 11:06:12 PM
S'all cool. True story: I play each Major Sigil before I make suggestions for it, along with a half-dozen others I don't choose to comment on. I do it all with the same team, a Fallen Carnage build that doesn't use spells, percentage damage, or debuffs, and I throw away two creature slots and an enchant on Nexus Amaranth, Nightwing Gargoyle, and Whoracle (buffs Emblem drops, resource drops, and legendary enchant drops).

I'm farming Major Sigils with effectively four monsters, and it's rare the enemy team ever gets a turn anyways.

I don't think that should happen, therefore the commentary.

Offline jamosup

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #18 April 14, 2015, 10:52:14 PM
There are heavy, heavy limits on how difficult I can make any of these fights, and I expect maybe four of the ones I've made so far will make people cast spells. Not lose; I mean, use their spellbooks. The player's ability to focus fire, bring properly stacked artifacts (with legendary enchants, even!), and buff with Perks are massive advantages that nothing I suggest can counter. That's not even bringing up the fact that since the Sigil tells you what the Nether is, you already have a pretty good idea of what to bring into the fight.

What I'm doing, rather, is making Major Sigils a noteworthy challenge, rather than something I burn two dozen of in a night with the same absentminded Q mashing I use in the first ten floors. The fact that they're the only place in the game, so far, that allows players to fight designed parties means that they're a unique challenge in the game right now, and that I should take up the gauntlet to make that designed angle a valuable facet of the experience.

That's true. I think I just got a bit scared with how much you played things up :P

Offline VagrantSun

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #17 April 14, 2015, 10:44:25 PM
There are heavy, heavy limits on how difficult I can make any of these fights, and I expect maybe four of the ones I've made so far will make people cast spells. Not lose; I mean, use their spellbooks. The player's ability to focus fire, bring properly stacked artifacts (with legendary enchants, even!), and buff with Perks are massive advantages that nothing I suggest can counter. That's not even bringing up the fact that since the Sigil tells you what the Nether is, you already have a pretty good idea of what to bring into the fight.

What I'm doing, rather, is making Major Sigils a noteworthy challenge, rather than something I burn two dozen of in a night with the same absentminded Q mashing I use in the first ten floors. The fact that they're the only place in the game, so far, that allows players to fight designed parties means that they're a unique challenge in the game right now, and that I should take up the gauntlet to make that designed angle a valuable facet of the experience.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2015, 10:46:01 PM by VagrantSun »

Offline jamosup

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #16 April 14, 2015, 05:48:16 PM
I have to ask - while your setups are extremely clever, is it necessary to make -every- sigil a puzzle that requires raising an entirely new team to beat for each one?

That was their intended purpose to begin with anyway :)
That's fair, heh. It's possible I think they sound too hard because I'm used to some major sigils just being too easy, though I do think some basic "building block" abilities should have simpler sigils. I think that's what he's going for, though. Super-strong abilities being in heavy "puzzle" fights, while simpler stuff has more of a fun theme with some synsergy?

Offline Zack

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #15 April 14, 2015, 05:09:33 PM
I have to ask - while your setups are extremely clever, is it necessary to make -every- sigil a puzzle that requires raising an entirely new team to beat for each one?

That was their intended purpose to begin with anyway :)
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Offline Juncboks

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #14 April 14, 2015, 05:06:44 PM
Well he's definitely making them strong, but I don't see majors sigils as something new players are going to be farming up much. They aren't all only counterable by one team, but definitely easier to beat a certain way. You'd only really need to have your creatures at about level 50 or so. Leveling them to that point should be easy. Just take some of your higher powerhouses and bring your little guys out to the bigger levels. They gain multiple levels each battle, so it goes quickly. I only have a couple nethers and I've leveled all of my creatures to near 40 with a stable of over half the creatures in the game. But I'm playing the scenic route :P
« Last Edit: April 14, 2015, 05:19:52 PM by Juncboks »
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Offline jamosup

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #13 April 14, 2015, 04:56:06 PM
I have to ask - while your setups are extremely clever, is it necessary to make -every- sigil a puzzle that requires raising an entirely new team to beat for each one? That'd make it awful hard on new players - if you can't beat -any- sigils, you're not going to make much progress. It just sounds at this rate they'll pretty much all be impossible without grinding a dedicated counter team up to speed for each, which seems like a bit much. Though, am I overestimating how strong you're trying to make them?

Offline Zack

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #12 April 14, 2015, 08:16:28 AM

Realtalk time: I've been going mostly for Sigils with abilities I can actually make a build around - there are plenty that it simply isn't possible for, such as the Wound Angels, or the Mirage/Disciple/Zealot Occultist. Should I go ahead and make teams for these anyways around whatever theme I come up with on the spot, or should I ignore them and go for significant Sigils (whatever ones I find, anyway?)

Whichever is most fun for you! Keep in mind that ultimately, the numbers will be tweaked on all abilities to the point that all creatures have some use.
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Offline Juncboks

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #11 April 14, 2015, 06:40:42 AM
Personally, if I may give input (love these sigil builds, by the way).
I'd say you should totally do those odd ability ones. Instead of trying to build around their ability, perhaps go for themes? Like giving the mirage Occultist a pet thrasher and a harpy screamer who take down the monsters she likes to harvest cores from. Add in an alcazar where she dwells, since she can't deal much damage, she'd have a fortress that could do it for her. Then two timeworn ents like forests that weaken the prey around her lair.
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Offline VagrantSun

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #10 April 14, 2015, 05:46:25 AM
And once more into the breach!
_____________________________________________

Moss Golem Sigil
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Let's go with a mini-burn theme this time, as it benefits from the time bought by Snare. Two Haunted Golems in back around an Ectoplasm Slime, to spread lots of Calm; and a Flaring Efreet and Scourge Mummy in the front. Simmer and let sit for 5 turns.


~*~

Brownie Captain Sigil
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I like the Blademaster paired with the Captain! Double down on it; bring in an Elder Ent and a Priest of Radiance, keep the Dark Brim Smith buffing the Blademaster, and drop in a Stronghold for flawless shielding. This'll be one of the rare offensive sigils.


~*~

Raging Efreet Sigil
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wtf triplets
I'll have to remember that you're okay with dupes of the Sigil monster. For right now, swap the back row for a Scourge Mummy and two Flamegrip Clutchers. Nothing's really going to survive a turn of Burn5 plus the Catching Fire damage, and the Firewound Angels aren't reliable status inflictors.

~*~

Harpy Pillager Sigil
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Commit! Bring in an Ethereal Clutcher and a Cinder Devil, then fill the back row with a Dark Brim Smith in between two Harpy Screamers. If either one of them manages to snag a kill from the excessive amounts of indirect damage happening in this build, they'll become fatally effective.


~*~

Ruby Paragon Sigil
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WTF SEXTUPLETS
Alright. Three Ruby Paragons up front, I don't disagree with that. Then an Ashwood Ent, a Gold Golem, and an Ectoplasmic Slime in the back row; the game plan is that the Paragons raise max HP continuously, drastically increasing the Link HP pool, while the Ashwood heals everything and the Gold Golem turns that monstrous pile of health that you're trying to burn through into a TPK.

___________________________________________________________

Realtalk time: I've been going mostly for Sigils with abilities I can actually make a build around - there are plenty that it simply isn't possible for, such as the Wound Angels, or the Mirage/Disciple/Zealot Occultist. Should I go ahead and make teams for these anyways around whatever theme I come up with on the spot, or should I ignore them and go for significant Sigils (whatever ones I find, anyway?)

Offline VagrantSun

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #9 April 13, 2015, 12:00:46 PM
I'm actually in the middle of building an arsonist team set up like this. Have a few bugs to work out but its almost done. It works amazing so far

If you've seen the Daily Duel concept, my immediate thought for one of them was this build:

Troll Arsonist (Itchy Finger)
Troll Arsonist (Itchy Finger)
Troll Arsonist (Itchy Finger)
Troll Arsonist (Itchy Finger)
Troll Arsonist (Topaz Attunement)
Troll Arsonist (Everything's Gone)

For the curious, that works out to about a 55% chance each turn to get an extra turn from the Itchy Squad. The probability curve for them not getting a free turn is more difficult to work out, but lies a few orders of magnitude below 1 percent.

All that said, everyone would just beat it with Lich Overseer spam, so it's not like it'd be hard to beat.

~*~

Agreed, Zack, the Arsonist sigil will be monstrous, but IMHO the Resin ability is one of the top five in the game, and no one should get it for free. Any of the sigils I do that have defining abilities are going to be grueling slugfests.

Offline Controledfail

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #8 April 13, 2015, 10:44:26 AM
I'm actually in the middle of building an arsonist team set up like this. Have a few bugs to work out but its almost done. It works amazing so far

Offline Zack

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Re: Major Sigil Commentary
Reply #7 April 13, 2015, 08:25:55 AM
That Troll Arsonist sigil is going to be brutal!
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